メインコンテンツへスキップ

Need to mark a hidden surface

コメント

39件のコメント

  • Jacant

    Select the face Right click - Face - Hide Face. To show it again, Pick anywhere in a blank space - Show all.

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    Thanks for this idea. But with 1800 objects and most of them hidden, I would not like to make all visible when I want just the surfaces be visible again. Is there an alternative to make just the surfaces visible again? Or could you possibly make the hiding surfaces just transparent for the single click on the hidden surface to select this one? In programs like Corel Draw e.g. you can alt click to step through all objects which are overlapping to get the single one you want to select.

    0
  • Jacant

    Have you created Components and Assembles? You can 'hide/turn off' any Component that you are not working on. Also by using Components you can cut down the file size. I would also use different layers, these to can be turned on and off.

    As an example, a Table.

    Draw one leg make into a Component. Copy the component to make four legs. The file size is reduced by only recording one leg and the positions of the copies. put these four Leg components into a new Component, called Table. This will become an 'Assembly', where you can make other Components to go in it. Say the 'Rails', again copy the Rail component. You could also make a Component that includes each piece of 'Wood' for the 'Top' making it a 'Sub Assembly'

    So now you have an Assembly named 'Table', inside there are Components for 'Legs', 'Rails' and a 'Sub Assembly' called 'Top' with 'Wood' Components inside.

    The file size is reduced because it only needs the information for one Component of each and the positions of the copies.

    Any or all of these can be turned on or off with a combination of 'Layers' and the 'Structure tree'.

    There are also controls when working on Components. If you Activate a Component, all other Components are 'greyed' out. You can also 'Open' a Component'. This opens the Component in its own file window. Any edits done here will automatically update in the master file.

     

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    Thanks Jacant!

    I'm using components and assemblies a lot. But there are not many 1:1 doublicates in my drawing, so I need to make their origin "independent" most of the time because (e.g. with complex item aluminium profiles) their size ist different (don't aks me how often I've forgotten to do so and the result was that be reducing the length of a copied part all the other parts went shorter too...).

    Here is part of my tree:

     

    But your idea to use Layers is fantastic. I've totally ingored that possibility to give me a better chance to switch certain groups of objects on and off. I will trie to start using them!

    0
  • Tim Heeney

    Using Layers is a good way to group 'un connected' (i.e not grouped by structure browser ) objects.

    DSM has other tools to quickly show / hide objects which might help you.

    Select any face ( or any collection of single faces from many parts ) and key 'ctrl h' will hide these parts. Alternatively, key 'alt h' will show only these parts ( i use this a lot) . Used in conjunction of using Inverse visibility, you can add other parts to the selected display group. 'ctrl shift h' is show all ...

    These commands might help you.

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    Thanks Tim for the shortcut keys. I fear this will not solve my problem: My drawing very complex (nearly 2000 objects grouped hirachically in many parts and assemblies which are only a few being 1:1 copies. This makes the system very slow and the overall performance when zooming or panning is a torture. So i definitely work with 90% of the parts hidden (which does make the performance a little better).

    So when something is in the way to select a certain surface, I hate to switch it invisble. Because making it visible again means to scroll through the object tree, find it and then switch it back visible again. And using "ctrl shift h" (or "unhide all") is even more work asw I need to get the 90% hidden again.

    So it seems to me the best idea to group the object I'm working on in layers, thus giving me the chance to have logical groups to quickly hide and unhide.

    --- Still, it would be nice to have a "transient hide" function, just for convenience. I then could "dig" into by hiding things, do my work to the destination part and then simply say "unhide the transient hidden parts. This would allow to hidethings ad hoc without the need to include or exclude them from a logical group first. Think of a journey into the drawing: Whenever a part is blocking your sight, you e.g. alt shift click on it and it gets transiently hidden (or just dimmed and transparent). When you have finished your journey, you click a command to make these parts (and no other) visible again. As I said, I'm used to such functions in vector drawing programs like Corel Draw or AI, where you can alt-click through overlaying parts (objects) of the drawing until the one you want to select is selected. Saves a lot of work in a complex drawing...

     

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    btw is there a right click menu possibility or even a key short cut to quickly transfer a selected object in my drawing to a certain (or even better: new) layer? Or must I use the layer tab to add a layer, activate it and click "add object to layer"?

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    So here is my solution for the problem:

    I add a new layer "transient invisibility", switch the main layer active again, make the new layer invisible.

    I then navigate through my "journey" into the drawing and whenever something blocks my sight, I tripple click on it and then right click on the new layer choosing "add to layer". The object blocking the sight gets invisble. I continue doeing so until I get to teh destination surface, make my changes and then comes the easy way to make the objects visible again:

    I right click the layer, select all objects and then right click on the main layer choosing "add objects to layer". I've just tested it and it works quite performant.

    0
  • Tim Heeney

    It's easier / quicker to tell you how i work...

    Select faces of parts you wish to be displayed, key 'alt h' to show only these parts.

    To add parts to this display, inverse visibility ( rmb the command or make shortcut in Options >customise>shortcuts - define etc), this inverts display without changing the view area. Select the face / faces of additional parts to show and this time key 'alt+h' to hide them , (that is to add them to original), now rmb inverse visibility again and...voila.

    I'm using 'alt+v' as a customised shortcut...

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    I've used this way a lot. But it is not practicable for me as I have no way to mark the destination part because it is hidden by overlayed objects. Searching it in my object tree is tuff (>2000 objects) although I have already structured it a lot. You know, sometimes you want to measure something in your drawing and you are currently working on a complete different aerea of the drawing. So if you have not memorized a quick way to navigate to this particular object in the tree it hard. In my case my system performance is down so much that even opening and closing parts of the tree takes seconds and it takes several seconds from clicking on an object inside the tree to get the selection frame shown in the drawing. so if you have 12 copies of a DIN screw they are all named the same and I don't want to make them named different because this would make the file even bigger and the performance would degrade. So to find the correct screw (which is hidden by other objects) I need to click on all the screws to see which is the one I need to make "solo-visible". This takes minutes to do in my case.

    Maybe I have misunderstood the working concept of DSM and I should have done the work completely different by first completing sections of the drawing in a seperate file and only at the end assmble all these external assamblies into the full drawing. But this is not what my clients like: They want to see "mock ups" in an early state. So I start drawing the complete whole. Later I go and add details everywhere. So this working concept doe not really complie with seperately editing sub-assemblies.

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    Could you possibly tell me a shortcut zooming into an area without using the scroll-wheel? Like using the mouse to draw a rectangular and then zoom to this rectangular?

    0
  • Tim Heeney

    I'm sort of time so forgive my short quick response...and i will go into working practices later tonight but for now.

    To select hidden parts: In selection filter choose 'bodies'...hover over object and it highlights, then ctrl + mmb wheel to cycle through ( drill down) through objects under curser - select it, then rmb > locate in structure tree ( i've a shortcut 'ctrl L'

    The working concept is job specific. For large assemblies like yours it really has to be part / sub assembly/ larger assembly etc set up. I agree this takes more time. It's possible to have the design all in one file and as the design becomes more solidified / stable, then start making related groups into assemblies etc.

    This way 'rmb > =component>open component will draw that part /assembly only - this might increase your display response x 10 easily! It is not necessary to have an independent file of this part/assembly to do this...

    more later tonight.

    Cheers.

     

     

    0
  • Tim Heeney

    yes, try this...select a face / part etc - key Z - works nicely in combination with selection options - auto zooms to selected entities...

    sorry - i mis read...Orient tab, Zoom> Zoom box in...neat - i just found that myself- DOH ! ( alt+Z )

     

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    Wow! Thanks so much this is worth gold! I always was using the scroll wheel only which is a torture with this big complex drawing. marking the part in my structure tree and then pressing z works like a 100 times turbo!!!

    0
  • Jacant

    Have you thought about 'Splitting' the screen to show different views?

     

     

    0
  • Tim Heeney

    you said earlier...

    'so if you have 12 copies of a DIN screw they are all named the same and I don't want to make them named different because this would make the file even bigger and the performance would degrade. So to find the correct screw (which is hidden by other objects) I need to click on all the screws to see which is the one I need to make "solo-visible". This takes minutes to do in my case.'

    Maybe a search could be of use here...

    'Ctrl F' brings up the 'find' dialogue...yes, i have made my own fastener database.

    2 examples - first i search in the entire document for a particular screw type - then i replace all the component instances in all the different component assemblies , irrespective of individual component orientation.

    next one - just a simple search of all the 'optic' parts - probably the example above is a better use of 'find'.

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    Okay, let me answer to your last comment, Tim:

    If your screws in the first example would be fare more distant one from another, you would need to zoom out pretty much to see them all in one view. So that's my problem. I do find the screws (just an example) in my structure tree, but it is hard to say which screw is which without seeing them all on the screen: You simply do not see the selcetion frame around them when you select them in the tree. So thats what I meant: I need to zoom in and out to find the right one and it gets tough when they are hidden behind other objects. So marking the screw I want to dig down to by using the search box would always mean I would need to zoom in and out.

    When you say you replace the instances, does that mean you change their origin to "independent" and rename them? I'm asking because this would corrupt the advantage of assemblies to be im memory only once.

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    Thanks for reminding me of the multi-windows feature, Jacant! I will try if this will force me to even more zooming (because of smaller windows) and less panning because I can leave a reference window open. I also need to find out if the performance will become better or worse with multiple windows open.

    The good thing with this method is that you can act across the windows: Select the object to be moved in one window and select the destination point in another window. I think this will help a lot to avoid zooming in case I make the above-mentioned mistakes during the destination selection and lose the selection of the object to be moved by pressing esc. In this case, I still see the origin position in full zoom and also the destination.

    Great! Thanks, Jacant! btw. are you a late worker like me, or do you live on the other side of the earth? I'm located in Germany, so it got pretty late (- not to say early) for me yesterday ;-)

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    Tim, this is an answer to your post 8h ago:

    1) I have used the possibility to right-click on a part and say "open part". Indeed this does accelerate the modification of this part very much. But the odds of this method is the fact that you have no neighbour parts as reference points any more. So it is worth to be used when I make numeric changes where I do not need reference points.

    2) Your "cycle through" seems to be exactly what I was looking for. But alas, I can't get it running. Maybe I misunderstand your ctrl + mmw What exactly do you mean? pressing ctrl key plus "m", "m", "w"? nothing happens when I do so.

    EDIT: okay, I just relised you simply mean to use ctrl plus scroll wheel!!! THAT IS WHAT I WAS LOOKING FOR!!! That is the perfect answer to my original question. Sadly the performance on my system with the huge drawing is poor and I need patience when turning the wheel. But well done, Thanks so much!

    0
  • Tim Heeney

    Sorry, yes mmw = middle mouse wheel.

    The 'open component' also can mean open assembly , open Imported file etc.

    Chat later this morning...time to sleep - oh one last thing...

    With cut and paste, if prior to the paste you select a face of something, the pasted object will appear at / on the selection object. So, no more 2m apart and it will be put under the structure browser active part.

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    It would be great if this copy-paste logic would work as you say. But for me it does not work like this. Here is what I do:

    opening / importing a part from a file. It appears in a new drawing tab.

    Selecting the part in the structure tree of the new drawing and clicking ^C

    Changing to my main drawing, selecting a surface about 2m away from the zero-point.

    Pasting with ^V the part into the drawing.

    What happens is that this part does appear near the zero point 2m away from the selected surface.

    What are you making different???

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    I have the feeling that it might make a difference if you paste a body or a component. I just tried to paste a body, and it worked fine. Maybe this does not work with components the same way?

    0
  • Tim Heeney

    Hi,

    Yes it seems to work with bodies and not components sadly. I didn't know that when i suggested it.

    Perhaps the two window idea is the best method.

    As a general suggestion, i would try to simplify your parts ( if possible  - but, i assume many of these are imported maufacturer's step files...)

    As an example, the extruded aluminium machine frame has many internal faces - i would estimate you only really need the exterior envelope.

    Another:  does a fastener really need to show the head recess information ?

    I'm getting short of further ideas...

     

     

     

     

     

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    I would estimate that 50% of the component are imported. When it comes to details... well, you know, you are absolutely right that for 95% of the time, I could live without all the internal details. But at the end of the day, my business is to build extraordinary exhibits for my customers. And there comes the 5%, essential: The customers want to see what they get before giving an okay to decisions. Let's take the aluminium framework: It makes a big difference if you see the filigree internals on a cut edge or just a grey pane. And to decide, if the extruded aluminium stud gets a cap (including which colour) on its end or not, they like to see a close-up shot of the situation.

    At the end of the day: I have never had such a complex drawing, and next time, I will change my workflow:

    Trying to build in separate groups of assemblies and components as long as possible and only put them together when needed for the 5% situations, where my customers want to get an impression.

    And I have never read more about these Lightweight components: What are their limitations and odds? Maybe using them could drastically reduce the system load. Take the 48 lightbulbs with glass bowl and filament inside. Looks great in a close-up shot, but man! This stuff is really complex (including the text on the their metal thread). If I could effectively replace them for 95% of the time and just use the detailed object during the 5% showtime - that would make a big difference. And it#s as I already said: Just making them invisible does not drastically reduce the system load.

     

    0
  • Jacant

    ...Great! Thanks, Jacant! btw. are you a late worker like me, or do you live on the other side of the earth? I'm located in Germany, so it got pretty late (- not to say early) for me yesterday ;-)...

    No not a late worker. I am retired,  so if I stay up late I can easily have a lie in until noon if need be. Ha Ha

    I am based in North Wales. (Helo o Gymru)

    As for 'Lightweight Components', be careful with them. You need to have the original file on the same computer for the program to access it. If you sent the file to your customers and the original imported file was not there then the Lightweight component would not show.

    Below is taken from the help files.

    Lightweight components

     

    If you have the Use lightweight assemblies option selected in the File import and export options, external components will be loaded as lightweight components. Only the component's graphic information is loaded.

    A lightweight assembly component uses less memory than an object that is fully loaded. You can quickly view the component with the Orient tools. When you are ready to work with it in DS Mechanical, you can load the geometry information.

    See also Displaying lightweight components and Internal and external components.

    To load a lightweight component

    Right-click the component in the Structure tree and select Load Component from the context menu.

    The component and all its subcomponents' geometry information is fully loaded. You can modify the components with any DS Mechanical tool.

    To make an external component lightweight

    Right-click the component in the Structure tree and select Make Lightweight from the context menu.

    The component becomes lightweight and uses less memory. You cannot make an internal component lightweight.

    0
  • Jacant

    ...I also need to find out if the performance will become better or worse with multiple windows open...

    If you press Ctrl , Alt, F9 it will give you a Performance report.

    0
  • Volker de Haas

    oh no! You should not have told me this key combination. Now I'm getting really jealous. 116 frames per second! What a dream! Here is mine, torturing me for weeks now :-(

    So Jacant, thanks again for using your retirement to help. These two discussions really brought light into the darkness for me.

    btw which software are you using to generate the animated gif pictures of your screen?

    0
  • Tim Heeney

    There is a big graphical performance improvement.

    However, i suggest caution without knowing the complete picture of how 'Lightweight' works completely...

    I suggest a few simple trials to establish you understand the complete working principle before any action on an important 'work' file...

    Just be cautious...

    0
  • Jacant

    btw which software are you using to generate the animated gif pictures of your screen?

    http://blog.bahraniapps.com/gifcam/ 

    0
  • Jacant

    I'm 'pending approval' again

    0

サインインしてコメントを残してください。